Waterloo1815 French infantry

[Marc the plasticsfan]

I see the new Voltigeurs are out, but cannot remember (nor find pictures of) whether W1815 had planned a grenadier set and a command set?

Does anybody know?

Thanks

Marc

[C M Dodson]

Hello Marc.

I seem to remember that the original sprue pictures had command figures with them.

When the two sets came out they were no where to be seen!

Drum and Flag actually issued a disclaimer to this effect as the disappointment was obvious.

The Voltigeurs can be used as grenadiers, but as to command, who knows!

Best wishes,

Chris

[Marc the plasticsfan]

That's not good. The voltigeurs are not of much use to me as I need marching elite companies to go with the fusileers, and command. I could use the Zvezda hard plastic sets to cover the gap, but the elites will mean no purchases of these sets for me. I hope this is a short term delay and not a cancellation of the missing figures.

I hope one of our Italian friends may know more, so fingers crossed until the bad news arrives

Marc

[Mr Schmitt]

Sorry here in Italy I just received the marching guys last week. No other news.

[Banater]

I've seen a part of the sprue.

It includes 4 marching poses, voltiguers and command. I can not tell you more as it was only partial view.
I clearly seen officer & horse, foot officer and drummer. Foot officer (I think) had bicorn, like Revell guards officer. How many other poses, I do not know.
Would be nice if someone would repost the link to the original masters. Probably there are other figures I've not seen.

I guess we are spoiled by MAC format - are we not?

If you want the right ratio, then wait for HaT MAC format 1815 French.

I understand the trouble well, as I bought about 15 boxes of marching ones plus 2 boxes of voltiguers.
I'm tempted to buy Zvezda command, but I am afraid they are hard to find as Zvezda lost government financial support.

These late French are essential, not just for French, but also fr Saxons, Westphalians and others...

Oh, and one reminder - Mr Pierrini of Waterloo is trying very hard to make sets in correct way. He understands that collectors are having very harsh criteria nowadays.
In that way, I have to point out that very harsh criticism that targeted this product on this forum ('drums are too small', 'soldiers do not fight like that', 'should not hold musket on that side' et c.) maybe prevented the release of the full set.

1000s of sprues have been cut to pieces in order to make small sets of marching and voltiguers. Thus the price is higher. Thus 1000s off commands are lost!

And - when and if released - do not complain that you are to get the same figures from released sets on one big sprue!

So, I beg you all, be careful what you say and try to be helpful...

Banater

[Marc the plasticsfan]

Yes, I followed the discussion/criticism of the original figures, and hope that Mr Pierrini took the comments in a constructive way. Us French Napoleonic fans have had so many poor sets of French infantry that we wanted his set (and HaT's) to be definitive. So asking him to correct the shoulder the musket was carried on, and the size of the drum, seem to me to be valid observations - otherwise we end up with the Italeri set of old.

I have supported Mr Pierrini's efforts by buying his figures (not just Napoleonics) - his French line lancers was a great set, along with the British dragoons, which greatly improved on the HaT set, and when he added another sprue to the box I was overjoyed. I have purchased metal command figures from him as well. So I truly hope to be able to buy these French, but I will only do that if their is the prospect of officers and maybe elite company marching figures. If his factory is cutting the command figures off the sprue, he should sell these online in bags if need be, as I would buy them loose in this format if he cannot produce boxes.

I would hope that we can be civil in our observations, but criticism of plastic soldiers is a fact of life now - gone are the days when we just bought Airfix and accepted it. There are so many choices available, that a modern manufacturer must try to get as much right as possible I think.

And interesting comments re Zvezda - I heard the owner died, so always interesting to hear news of a once great company, as I still hope they can return, or licence their moulds to another manufacturer.

Best wishes

Marc

[C M Dodson]

With respect to these command sections would it not be an idea to market them as such rather than discard them?

Even if they came in a plastic bag thus saving packaging costs they would still have a value.

I know that I for one was disappointed not to have received them in the sets that I bought. I know that Mr P kindly changed the musket shoulders but was unaware of any malicious criticisms.

The Voltigeurs have pride of place on my Ligny bridge scene and in my opinion look lovely.

Best wishes,

Chris

[Banater]

As for lost commands - it has been a financial failure to the company.

One pays for the mold and calculates that there would be 4 marching figures, 6 voltiguers and 4 command figures - and there you are, you loose about 20-25% of the investment, not counting that you pay extra for cutting sprues and two additional boxes.

You all have to realize that companies would do much better if they would only produce plastic bottle corks then toy soldiers.
There is interest in toy soldiers that makes them do so - especially the small companies!

In contrast - look at the big guys: even big Italery is very careful not to produce something that does not sell, Airfix did just one set in ages, also Revell, and they are the ones that go to into wide distribution trough contracts with supermarkets and mega-stores!

As for Zvezda - 'I heard the owner died, so always interesting to hear news of a once great company, as I still hope they can return, or licence their moulds to another manufacturer'
True, but it was originally company from Moldova. It was taken to Russia and turned into government program - sold to the kids in Russia as a part of their classes in school! Imagine if any small producer would have that ability! (by the way that is how it was done in Soviet block, take KP for an example).
Or you use distributors to sell your product with other things, as does one popular company. Combination of smuggling and blackmail...

To licence molds to another company is very unlikelly as it is, like everything else in Russia, state owned and you also have sanctions.

So, please be aware of the difference between small and big company. Small ones take huge risk in order to produce anything, and more they produce the higher the risk. One bad set can ruin the company!

I hope that Waterloo learned that it is better to produce just marching poses and that it was - after all, a success. But the stress it produces to the person that invests a huge amount of money can damage health also.

I came to this forum just for this reason - I have to react and to point out that child's game can easy be deadly if we forget what really is behind.

You have had not been in the position of the owner...

Best regards,

Banater

[Marc the plasticsfan]

Totally agree

"So, please be aware of the difference between small and big company. Small ones take huge risk in order to produce anything, and more they produce the higher the risk. One bad set can ruin the company!

I hope that Waterloo learned that it is better to produce just marching poses and that it was - after all, a success. But the stress it produces to the person that invests a huge amount of money can damage health also.

I came to this forum just for this reason - I have to react and to point out that child's game can easy be deadly if we forget what really is behind."

Yet the comments I see directed at HaT, which is one man's "baby", seem just as spiteful. A strange hobby we inhabit, us plastic toy soldier enthusiasts

[Banater]

Back to 1815 French:

They are to appear on Hannants - 56 figures in one set (complete set). Would it be 3 or 4 sprues, or there would be an odd sprue it is for us to guess. If there are to be 'wrong shoulder' figures, they will be useful for NCO's.

By the way, have you noticed that epolettes have been reworked on 'voltiguers'? Obviously in the factory and not by the original sculptor - additional cost...

And dear Mark,

HaT is not the only 'one man's baby'.

For example owner of Lucky Toys produced sets 'just because he likes them that way' - regardless on the choice of poses or comments from other people. He find his inspiration in cartoons-comic books and he produces TOYS in the first place. I do not think that in his case the profit was an issue. I have big respect for Fausto!

But when I read comments on MM Swiss Vatican Guards! Beautiful figures with just some minor issues - I am positive that that one set company was destroyed in few comments: 'shoes are not correct' (come on! shoes! most companies produce them in the shape of a blob!) or 'stripes on the uniform should be in different angle' (really!). I think it was venture of the sculptor, but it seams to be the last one. Besides, it was molded by Caesar - and Caesar uses only their sculptor(s) if you want to hire them...

Banater

[Marc the plasticsfan]

I like the sound of one box, big sprue for the French. Is this shown anywhere? The W1815 FB page is quite old/out of date

And interesting re the hobby. It is so easy to think of these companies as major businesses, yet they are in reality small owner managed affairs. I think even Italeri is just two brothers, and I assume that came from Esci in some way.

Always a challenge - how to balance criticism and praise. PSR leads the way, yet people take offence still.