Hat crowdfunding Nappy Prussians

[MikeM]

Pricewise, I find the crowdfunding initiative quite acceptable, if it were for an item that would not sell otherwise. For a Napoleonic staple like Prussian Landwehr, I really cannot understand these sets not being in the mainstream production plan, alongside the myriad of French sets. As has already been mentioned, the masters have been done for years, so it was just a case of scaling down and making moulds. The same goes for the late Russian musketeers. I have been waiting for decent-sized Prussian Landwehr for many years now, putting off alternate purchases, but over the past 3 years I have replaced my venerable Airfix figures with various substitutes, a few with HäT Russian Militia figures, but mainly with Kennington/SHQ, Art Miniaturen and Schilling. I have recently finished painting these substitute figures and now no longer need the HäT sets, after waiting (and hoping) many years for their release. I very much hope that the long promised Prussian limbers and caissons might appear sometime in the next year, otherwise I will also have no need for them, either, having already replaced most of my original substitute pieces with metal.

[Zed1]

I'm pretty sure that nobody here has any problem with the fact that a company wants to earn money.
I don't see the 'hatred' in critizing the price policy of a company. I also don't understand where the point was when critique generally became 'hatred'.

But I see a development - not only in miniature business, but in many other fields of business as well - in which companies switch the terms of investment to the customer's side in order to keep their own books neat.
Back in the old days, a company produced a product, put it on the shelve and waited for the customer to buy it. Nowadays, a company makes a 'concept' of a product and wants the customer to pay for it before it is even produced. That's what crowdfunding really is: putting all the financial risk onto the customer.

That's understandable when it's in regard to start-ups or small scale businesses that don't have the initial invest or cannot get a bank loan to finance pre-production. But now, more and more mid-size companies are starting to do it the same way...

...next big thing will be 'print on demand' when high-end 3d-printing becomes affordable for everyone.

What effect will this new HaT strategy have for their distribution channels? Will it - on the long run - put an end to resellers selling HaT figures?

[Beano Boy]

Based upon Jan`s comment. "MABO!"

The problems as I understand them, are ones of supply and demand for these new sets.
No toy shop,or department store ,or shop on the ww-web,will buy products not boxed up.
The world of emotive advertising demands this. If the box looks good they fly off the shelves and profits are made, even if the stuff inside is rubbish.Shops do not deal in bubble wrapped products, unless they are orders of washing up bowls.Here we have a prime example of good looking toy soldiers unboxed.Investments along the production lines to produce box art and boxes cannot be short-cut in this way.On a plus side,`Pacific Coast Company, Haet Toy Soldiers,' have saved everyones need to put up shelving for displaying boxes. So these sets are not going to be made available to buy in shops.There are other marketing options available, and there are several other selling outlets possible too,that would cost very little per shipment,and those moulding machines would be able to spit out toy soldiers all day long because of demand,but I am not retained to solve other big companies problems.
"so that emotive information stays with bb" The little button shyly remarked.
I ask myself would a book sell without a cover and back-cover? No it would not. BB

[zulu`s 1000`s of em]

Well, if they don`t get made through lack of support, no boxes needed . The project is crowdfunded, so those supporting the project get the figures first plus the bonus figures, if successful and all from Hat direct, no shop involved . Now IF the project gets support and goes ahead I have no doubt they will appear in shops at some point in the future, but that could be some time after the crowdfunders have had the figures. You guys are all putting the cart in front of the horse.

[zulu`s 1000`s of em]

Zed1, the world is changing, retailers here in the UK are failing and going out of business everyday, including some of the biggest. The old days are gone and gone forever , the internet is not going away. The way we sell and buy has changed, As a business you either change and adapt or go out of business, that is the way of the world, You talk of Hat as a BIG business , Hat is essentially one man working from a spare bedroom at home, and I get the impression the spare bedroom is not that big either ! He does everything and is everything Hat, one man , BMW is big , Audi is big, Hat is a cottage industry , it may be bigger than one or two other cottage industries in this hobby but it most certainly is not a BIG business. The customers bare the risk ? no they don`t if the project does not progress they get a full refund as the guys who backed the 1/32 Austrians know. If there is not enough demand why should any one person take the risk of making figures that may not sell ? is that fair ? why gamble when you can gauge in advance the commercial viability of a set. The world is changing and the toy soldier business is not immune to change. Hat Hate , well it seems to me that you and a few others seem to have it in for the guy, because you consistently knock Hat but not the other manufacturers, read through this thread to see I have asked four , now five times why moan just at Hats prices when CAESAR ZVEZDA and WATERLOO 1915 are charging the same per figure ??? So I stand by the statement there are Hat haters here. so ask who has done more for the hobby.....than this one man ,ever ?

[Kekso]

I kindly ask you to remain this discussion polite. Thank you.

[zulu`s 1000`s of em]

It is, and on my part at least factual.

[FredG]

This one man is remarkable. He can run two separate production lines simultaneously.

[zulu`s 1000`s of em]

I hope that comment is sincere and not sarcastic , the two factory`s are in China , he is in the US , The sculptors are global, the artists for the box art are global , few in the process have English as a first language , the box art once approved by him is then printed in another factory, they then have to be put together so the figures can be put in a box outer, he then has to organize collection and shipping, once at arrival and cleared off customs they have to be shipped to distributors , these he has contacted and deals with personally , he also deals with us when we moan etc etc etc etc etc etc, so yes this one guy does very well ,

[Zed1]

Well, Zulu - by the size and presence of their products, it is very unlikely that all this comes from one single backyard office and is executed by just one person only. Whatever the case - I certainly won't compare a figure manufacturer with a multinational industrial combine.

As for the rest - just because something evolves in this or that direction doesn't mean that I have to like it nor that I have to participate. And of course crowdfunding DOES outsource the economical risk from the producer to the customer - even if they get their money back when there's not enough funds to start production, this doesn't change the simple economic facts, because having no product when there's not enough demand certainly IS the risk of the potential customer. The company risks nothing: if enough people jump aboard the band wagon, there's enough money for business, if not, well - the few investors get refunded, everything steps back to zero and that's it. Company only invested some time for marketing.

As a customer, I'm free to decide where to spend my money and which company politics I support or not. Living is about making decisions. If that means I'm out, then I'm out. Call me a dinosaur.
But that's a simple pro/con-mechanism. No emotions involved. Especially not what you call 'hate'.

[FredG]

Of course it's sarcastic. You claim to be stating facts and then counter that with completely different facts. So there's really not one man in a (very small) spare bedroom producing these figures. Well bless me

[zulu`s 1000`s of em]

Zes1 , sorry but I have to disagree about risk and here is why, the master figures of a set exist, and have been paid for by Hat , it goes to crowdfunding, it fails , Hat have lost money, the customers have lost nothing, no money and no figures because for one reason or another they did not want them, the sculptor gets paid the only loser is Hat, the customer has zero risk. The only risk is disappointment for those that back a project that does not go ahead, those that sit on the sidelines waiting or complaining things are not perfect for them cannot be disappointed because they never wanted it to start with.

[zulu`s 1000`s of em]

Fred, Hat is a one man business Fact, don`t believe me ask Benno our host .

[Graeme]

Yes, I suspect that several of the companies that make our figures are like that. One person, or a couple of people trying to bring all the various stages of production together from various outsources. And they are all remarkable. The image that comes to my mind when I think about it is of the guy I saw at Canberra one year who was juggling an egg, a bowling ball and a chainsaw.

When a company is just one or two people life must get in the way sometimes. I recall one occasion when a company told us that production might be disrupted a little because there was a civil war happening at the end of their street!

It's apparent to me that there has been some disruption in HaT's operation, and some of the guys on the HaT forum who perhaps know more than the rest of us were hinting that there might be unavoidable reasons for that. if that's the case then if my pre paying for a few sets that. quite frankly, I really want helps HaT get back on track then I think I'll do that. if they cost me a few extra bucks, and I'm not sure that they will, I think that's ok this time. Next time it might be different.

If this crowd funding initiative isn't for you fair enough but I would encourage everyone to at least give it your consideration. I'd like to see this set get of the ground.

[zulu`s 1000`s of em]

Well said and thank you Graeme.

[sansovino]

Do you think that companies like Strelets, Emhar or Waterloo 1815 and many others have more than one person who is responsible for all matters? And I admire all these passionate producers which give us the possibility to continue our hobby of 1/72 worlds!

But I am really bored from these endless, more and more tear-driven sentences what make Haet unique! Haet is one of the most interesting producers - not my favorite, but one of the best -, but surely not unique. And Zulu has lost a long time ago the capacity for an open dialogue and blaming other positions as hate-postions which shouldn´t be allowed in this wonderful vivid and open forum.

[zulu`s 1000`s of em]

Sorry I call a spade a spade, and there is history with a few people on this forum complaining unfairly about hat and for that matter where have I EVER said on this thread or any other Hat are unique ? tear driven ??? where ?? and this is a good forum it is a shame the moderators have not dealt with some of the anti Hat rhetoric in the past. Open dialogue .....you mean like Fred inferring I was lying ? did you or other complain then ? so show me the evidence.

[FredG]

Fred, Hat is a one man business Fact, don`t believe me ask Benno our host .

Is his name Jackie?

[Kekso]

I think this topic is going nowhere

[zulu`s 1000`s of em]

It`s been going nowhere for days, all I wanted to do was bring the latest crowdfunding initiative to everyone`s attention. Fred one man and a part time admin, your clutching at straws now.